Cross and Gavel Podcast

The Cross & Gavel Podcast is designed for Christian attorneys and law students, but our topics range from pop culture to theology, from books to movies.

Host Anton Sorkin invites a variety of guests to speak on topics relating broadly to faith and culture, but our focus is on the intersection of faith and work, particularly work in the law.

Listen in!

You can listen to some of our favorites on this page, or you can subscribe on iTunes or search “Cross and Gavel” on any podcast app. Find most episodes archived here. Episodes 1-31 can be found here. If you enjoy the podcast, leave a comment and rating on iTunes.

    Recent Podcasts

    Break Every Yoke — Joshua Dubler & Vincent W. Lloyd

    Joshua Dubler & Vincent W. Lloyd

    Joining me this week to talk about abolitionism and religion are the authors of Break Every Yoke: Religion, Justice, and the Abolition of Prisons. Joshua is the associated professor of religion and director of the Rochester Education Justice Initiative at the University of Rochester. Vincent is an associate professor of theology and religious studies at Villanova University, where he directs the Villanova Political Theology Project.

    Cancel Wars — Sigal R. Ben-Porath

    Sigal R. Ben-Porath

    With widespread protests on university campuses, the question of reconciling free speech and inclusion is more important than ever for instutitional integrity. Joining me this week to talk about this balance is professor of education, philosophy, and political science at the University of Pennsylvania, and author of Cancel Wars: How Universities Can Foster Free Speech, Promote Inclusion, and Renew Democracy — Sigal R. Ben-Porath.

    Generative AI & the Legal Profession — Kevin Lee

    Kevin Lee

    Joining me this week to talk about the AI revolution and its impact on the legal profession is the Intel Social Justice and Racial Equity Professor of Law at North Carolina Central University, Kevin Lee.

    Tax Law, Religion, and Justice — Allen Calhoun

    Allen Calhoun -adjunct professor at Trinity Law School

    Joining me today to talk tax justice and church history is adjunct professor at Trinity Law School and author of the formative study — Tax Law, Religion, and Justice: An Exploration of Theological Reflections on Taxation — Allen Calhoun.

    SPECIAL EPISODE: The Future of Intimacy After Dobbs — Louise Perry & Helen Roy

    Louise Perry & Helen Roy

    Over the 2023 March for Life, CLS co-sponsored an event Thursday night with FCLNY and Guiding Star Project as part of the Reframing Agency series. This is the second installment of that series, covering the future of intimacy after Dobbs. For this event, we are joined by two panelists, Louise Perry, columnist at The New Statesman and author of The Case Against the Sexual Revolution: A New Guide to Sex in the 21st Century, and Helen Roy, contributing editor of the American Mind and host of the podcast GIRLBOSS INTERRUPTED. Our moderator is Dr. Alisia Chase, Professor of Art History and Visual Culture at SUNY Brockport and FCLNY’s resident feminist scholar.

    SPECIAL EPISODE: Moral Leadership in a Moral Hostage Crisis — Chaplain (MAJ) Mark Lee

    Chaplain (MAJ) Mark Lee

    In this episode of the Leadership Roundtable, we are joined by Chaplain (MAJ) Mark Lee to discuss moral leadership in an institutional setting hostile to it. Chaplain Lee has an incredible bio, including a number of civilian and military degrees, several commendation medals, and a ministry background across the world, including serving as the CLS President at the University of Hawaii and pastoring the largest congregation in the U.S. Army.

    SPECIAL EPISODE: Integrating Faith in Legal Practice — Andrew Speicher

    Andrew Speicher

    A conversation with Andrew Speicher about navigating faith from the big law to the small in the State of Kansas. This conversation was part of the Foundations Series, a new web content venture from Christian Legal Society aimed at helping Christian law students transition from 3Ls to first-year associates.

    The Character Gap — Christian B. Miller

    A. C. Reid Professor of Philosophy at Wake Forest University & Christian Miller - Author

    Joining me this week to talk about how we can bridge the vices and virtues of our character gap is the A. C. Reid Professor of Philosophy at Wake Forest University, Christian Miller. He is the author of several books on moral psychology, moral character, and honesty.

    Bridging the Civil & Divine — Karen Taliaferro

    Karen Taliaferro

    Joining me on this first-of-the-year episode to talk about the civil and divine law, and what can bridge the difference, is assistant professor and author at Arizona State University, Karen Taliaferro. Her book is called The Possibility of Religious Freedom.

    Works of the Law — Matthew J. Thomas

    Matthew J. Thomas

    Joining me today to talk about the debate surrounding what Paul meant when he invokes “works of the law” (Romans 3:20, Galatians 2:16) is Matthew J. Thomas. He is an assistant professor of biblical studies at the Dominican School of Philosophy and Theology in Berkeley, California. He is also the author of the book, Paul’s “Works of the Law” in the Perspective of Second-Century Reception.

    SPECIAL EPISODE: Leading in Times of Injustice — Dean Eric Enlow

    Eric Enlow, Dean at Regent University

    In this episode of the Leadership Roundtable, we are joined by Dean Eric Enlow, calling in from South Korea. His topic is a fascinating one: public witness and persecution, with an emphasis on the political theology of Pastor Wang Yi, a house-church pastor currently serving a prison term in China. Eric is the dean and a professor of law at Handong International Law School (HILS). He is an expert on Christian legal theory and teaches courses covering the biblical, systematic and historical relation between Christ and the law. Pastor Wang Yi’s declaration (read by Eric) can be accessed here and Yi’s new book can be purchased here. For more on the forum and the speaker, check out the YouTube page here.

    SPECIAL EPISODE: Justin Giboney at CLSNC 2022

    Justin Giboney, Speaker at CLSNC 2022

    Lecture from Justin E. Giboney (AND Campaign) at this year’s CLS National Conference in Newport Beach, CA. Following him on Twitter at @JustinEGiboney.

    131. Romans 13 — Conference Roundtable

    Eric Enlow, Myron Steeves, Frank Beckwith, Eddie Colanter, Mike Schutt (aka "Not a Dean of Anything").

    A special group of perfect strangers got together one evening during the 2022 CLS National Conference to talk about Aquinas, swingsets, and the authority of God. A few week later their audio was found. Caveat Emptore. Cross & Gavel is a production of CHRISTIAN LEGAL SOCIETY. The episode was produced by Josh Deng, with music from Ghostrifter. A special thanks to Nick and Ashley Barnett for their contribution in making this podcast possible.

    130. The Church After Innovation — Andrew Root

    Andrew Root

    Joining me this week to talk about the dangers of adopting an “always be innovating” model for the church is Andrew Root. His new book (“The Church After Innovation: Questioning Our Obsession with Work, Creativity, and Entrepreneurship”) is now available (here).


    1. Religion of Silicon Valley (#120)

    2. Christian Leadership in Uncertain Terrain (#110)

    Cross & Gavel is a production of CHRISTIAN LEGAL SOCIETY. The episode was produced by Josh Deng, with music from Vexento. A special thanks to Nick and Ashley Barnett for their contribution in making this podcast possible.


    Elizabeth Miller, CEO, International Organization for Stopping Exploitation of Women (IOSEW)
    Brianna Racchini, Executive Director Triad Ladder of Hope

    Anton Sorkin talks with two executive directors for their respective organizations about modern day slavery in the form of sex trafficking. Liz runs the International Organization for Stopping Exploitation of Women (IoSEW) and Brianna runs Triad Ladder of Hope (here). For more on this heinous crime, check out the memoir Girls Like Us from Rachel Lloyd.

    Jason Thacker, Director of the Research Institute, The Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission

    Joining this week to talk about the all important work of preparing the church to tackle the technological age is Jason Thacker — the chair of research in technology ethics and director of the research institute at The Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission (ERLC)

    Greg Forster, Political Science Professor, Trinity International University

    Joining this week to talk about how Christianity lost its cultural influence and can begin rebuilding it anew is political science professor at Trinity International University—Greg Forster. His book, Joy for the World, can be purchased here.

    Special Episode: Dr. Jason Lepojärvi, George Fox University

    For our first ever Leadership Roundtable, the students and I were joined by Dr. Jason Lepojärvi on the topic of overcoming resentment culture and better loving our neighbors. Jason is the C.S. Lewis Associate Professor of Theology & Literature (Honors Program) at George Fox University.

    Benjamin Storey, Visiting Fellow, The American Enterprise Institute, Author, 

    Finding contentment is difficult. So, instead, we replace that pursuit with temporal acts of distraction and pleasure. Joining me this week to discuss the search for meaning through the eyes of four French philosophers is AEI Fellow and author of “Why We Are Restless” — Benjamin Storey.

    Dr. Winnifred Sullivan, professor of religious studies and co-director, Center for Religion and the Human at Indiana University
    Pete Williamson, Staff Member, Intervarsity Christian Fellowship, Chaplain, Harvard University

    Anton Sorkin is joined by Dr. Winnifred Sullivan and Pete Williamson to talk about the ministry of presence and the role of chaplaincy on university campuses.

    Clarke Forsythe, Senior Counsel, Americans United for Life

    Anton Sorkin is joined by Clarke Forsythe to close out our summer of Dobbs in a discussion about the option itself and the looming state of demedicalized abortion.

    John Kleining, Author, Lecturer, Australian Lutheran College

    With the end of Roe comes a renewed conversation about the meaning of sex and the purpose of our physical bodies. Here to discuss the theology of the body and his new book — Wonderfully Made — is a Lutheran man from a land down under: John Kleining.

    Subscribe to Cross & Gavel Podcasts through iTunes here or on any podcast app on your phone or tablet. Cross & Gavel is a project of Christian Legal Society.



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